Ice-T is still around after 20 years in the game because he’s remained true to his principles, whether blasting cops in the controversial body count song “Cop Killer” or playing a cop on “Law and Order: SVU.” “I believe in the hustle, and that’s what I stand by,” he says.
Ice-T … Still The Original Gangster
He has just finished a full-day shoot on the set of the hit TV show Law & Order: Special Victims Unit, and Ice-T is ready to decompress. As he and his busty girlfriend Coco enter their luxury high-rise in Manhattan, he playfully teases the doorman about his white gloves. Then he gets on the elevator to his rooftop apartment, still thinking about the gloves. “This place just got new management, and they’re trying to spruce shit up,” he says. “The white gloves are all part of that. What it really means is rent is gonna go up another $1,000 a month.”
Ice-T is always thinking about money. He has frequently chosen TV and film roles mainly for the paycheck, and he’s become a master of multitasking to generate extra cash. At the time of this interview, in addition to Law & Order: SVU, on which he plays the street-savvy Detective Odafin “Fin” Tutuola, the onetime Grammy nominee is writing a new solo rap record and recording an album with his heavy-metal band, Body Count. He is also getting ready to issue a disc called Sex, Money, Guns by his hard-core rap group SMG. In addition to all that, he’s peddling on his Website a spoken-word CD called Pimp Penal Code, which features anecdotes and tips from real pimps, and he’s got a line of products, including Liquid Ice energy drink and Royal Ice malt liquor.
Ice clearly has a knack for making dough, and he also knows how to spend it. His wardrobe is exquisite; his closet is lined with designer suits, stellar pimp hats, and quality casual wear. His New York apartment, small compared to the house he used to own in Los Angeles, is cavernous by Manhattan standards. Against one wall of the living room, which is decorated with luxe black leather couches and chairs, is a giant flat-screen TV, and the walls are covered with framed posters of gangster films. The shelves and countertops are decorated with photos of Ice and Coco in affectionate poses. In the corner next to the giant window that overlooks the city, a pair of binoculars sits on a tripod. “I’m not using them to spy on the neighbors,” Ice says. “I’m making sure no one’s looking in on my punk ass.” Then he adds with a laugh, “There’s a lot more freaky-ass shit going on in here than out there.”
He won’t reveal what kinds of freaky shit he’s talking about, but the smile on his face suggests that he and Coco partake in some interesting nocturnal activities. “Man, she blows my mind,” he says of his girlfriend of more than two years. “And not just sexually. It’s work, it’s friendship, it’s everything. See, you just gotta find the right person, and once you do that, it seems strange to be with anyone else.” When Ice-T speaks, he doesn’t just answer questions; he launches eagerly into life lessons. “Monogamy is something that has to be self-imposed. Your girl can’t say, ‘You better not fuck anybody.’ You gotta be like, ‘I don’t want to fuck anybody else.’ I don’t want to. And she’s gotta feel the same way. And you can’t be like, ‘I can’t lie to my girl ‘cause I’ll get caught.’ It’s more like, ‘I can’t lie to her. I can’t do it.’ It’s gotta be from the heart.”
One of the reasons Ice-T is still around after 20 years in the game is because he has remained true to his principles, whether blasting cops in the controversial Body Count song “Cop Killer” or playing a cop in the film New Jack City. “I believe in the hustle, and that’s what I stand by,” he says. “I’ll look someone in the eye and say, ‘I’m not gonna let you judge me if I’m trying to get some money. I got friends in jail and I got shit I gotta handle, so who are you to tell me what I can’t do in order to hustle?’ And people respect that. So I’d be running through Harlem with a gun as a police officer in a movie and have the drug dealers be like, ‘Yeah, get your money, Ice.’”
“For the average dude, sex is so hard to get in the normal world, then you go into a power game like a rock concert and you see the same chicks that would make a normal guy take then on 25 dates before they gave it up, and they’ll lick your bus driver’s ass in a second. It really gets to your brain.”
Ice-T was born Tracy Morrow in Newark, New Jersey, in February 1959, and moved to Los Angeles at a young age after his parents died in a car accident. There, he quickly became immersed in the musical scene that would evolve into hip-hop. In school he rapped about his innocuous daily activities, but his rhymes turned ugly after he joined the street gang the Crips at age 16, which exposed him to the violence and crime that would inform his future music. He dropped out of high school, then spent two years in the Army to try to escape the thug life. It didn’t work, he says, and he returned to crime as a pimp. At the same time, he started fine-tuning his articulate gangsta raps and adopted the name Ice-T from Iceberg Slim, a pimp and novelist he idolized.
His first professional rap gig and film appearances were in 1984, in the low-budget Breakin’ and Breakin’ 2: Electric Boogaloo. Then, in 1986, Ice had a life-altering experience when he was nearly killed in a car accident. He vowed that when he recovered he would dedicate his life to music, not crime.
That move paid off. Ice landed a deal with Sire Records in 1987, and later that year he released his first album, Rhyme Pays, which went gold. His 1988 follow-up, Power, went gold even faster and was critically acclaimed for its gritty realism. Ice followed with five more solo records, the most recent of which was 1999’s 7th Deadly Sin.
He also recorded three albums with Body Count. The metal band’s self-titled 1992 debut featured the controversial “Cop Killer,” a burst of hard-core fury about getting even with rogue policemen by blowing them away. The public outcry that followed the song’s release was voluble, and Warner Bros. wound up removing the track from the album and dropping Ice from the label.
Fortunately for Ice, when the music industry cooled on him, Hollywood came a knockin’. He had done New Jack City, and the following year he and NWA’s Ice Cube played thugs in Trespass. Since then, lce-T has acted in some 45 films of varying quality. He hooked up with Law & Order: SVU in 1999 through executive producer Dick Wolf, who had first worked with Ice on the 1997 series Players and on New York Undercover.
Along the way, Ice also fathered two children, Tracy Junior and Letesha, with his previous girlfriend of 17 years, Darlene Ortiz.
Penthouse recently sat down with the original gangsta to talk about TV, Hollywood, the ups and downs of the music biz, home sex movies, and the things a chick will do to meet a star.
You’re a regular on Law & Order: Special Victims Unit you’re working on rap and metal records, you’ve got product endorsements. When do you have time to breathe?
I’ve always been overworked and one minute from losing my mind, even before I was in show business, even when I was on the streets hustling. A lot of people would like to do lots of things; they just don’t have the opportunity. I’ve always believed that if the opportunity arises, you should jump at it.
Why did you want to do Law & Order: SVU?
Because they pay per episode. If I go on the show and say, “Huh?” I get the same money as if I’m in it heavy. That was attractive to me. Also, they told me I’d have a lot of time to do my music. I can’t really start a tour, but I can do things on the weekend.
You’ve been on the show for five years. Do you enjoy it?
Being in music for so long, I kind of like the regimen of a television show. Being able to just go in, do my job, come home, and play Playstation without having a whole bunch of things standing over me is more relaxing than being my own boss. I’ll probably stay on the show a couple more years and then try to make my move back to the big screen. I can’t really do film while I’m doing this, but it’s like college to me. I’m honing my acting skills by working every day with a high caliber of actors. You can’t do nothing but get better.
How does being an actor compare to being a musician?
Being a musician is a real gamble. It’s a lot of work, it’s a lot of blood. People cry and scream at each other to get a record together, and you can put it out and have it not do what it’s expected to do. It doesn’t even have to flop. Some people’s failures do two and three million in sales. And that kind of rollercoaster ride is like having a child; it’s more than most people are ready to deal with on a regular basis. So there is more stability in film. If you sign on for a movie, you’re gonna get paid. But who’s saying you’re gonna get another movie? Now, with television, when they sign you for a year, you can count that money is coming. If they fire you in the middle of the year, they still gotta pay you. So it is more stable … more like a job than anything I’ve ever done.
What’s the environment like on the Law & Order set?
The show runs like a machine. Everyone knows what they’re doing, and these cats make it look easy. When a show’s doing good, it’s fun to work on. If it starts doing bad, it gets horrible and everybody starts blaming each other for everything. As it is now, it’s a very pleasant job. I’ve never had a harsh word with anybody or had any problems.
“We’re leaving people dead. And the survivors have memories, and they’re not just going to go away. …It may come back on our kids.”
Was anyone at Law & Order worried about working with the guy who did “Cop Killer”?
No, ‘cause I’m there early every day and I’m not causing any trouble. I know this is an opportunity for me, so I’m not gonna fuck up. Also, hip-hop culture has become so embedded into American culture that the people with the money grew up on our music. The average film executive was going to college when Power was out, so he loves me. I can walk into the CEO’s office of 50 percent of the corporations, and they’re like, “I went to college on your records.” So that hate factor is not there.
Its incredible how many rappers are doing well in films: Ice Cube, Eminem, Snoop, OMX, Queen Latifah.
The thing of it is, you don’t sleep on no kid from the street. A lot of kids from the streets may be walking around with their hands in their pockets, but these are bright kids. It’s just a question of opportunity. So when you take the rappers, who have already figured a way to grab themselves and get a little bit out of the ghetto, and you give them another opportunity, they’re gonna explode.
Do you think the mainstream success of guys like Jay-Z and 50 Cent has resurrected gangsta rap?
I don’t think it ever went away. To me, it’s been the only mainstay of hip-hop that has survived. You had Arrested Development and the pop stuff, but right through the dead center of that you got Ice-T, NWA, Too Short, Biggie Smalls, Tupac, Snoop Dogg, 50 Cent, Jay-Z, Lil’ Kim. It never stopped.
But didn’t the shooting deaths of Tupac Shakur and Biggie Smalls in 1996 and 1997 significantly cool down the scene?
That maybe cooled the hip-hoppers off a little bit from testing the waters of how real this shit was, but it was still all over the place, and now it’s bigger than ever. To me, 50 Cent is the rebirth. It’s like NWA right back in your face. I watch 50 Cent videos, and they got the bulletproof vests on. We were wearing bulletproof vests. And they’re recycling the big medallions too. But it’s cool because the kids 50 is hitting were not around with NWA, so it’s new and he’s a great rapper.
Why are people still enthralled with the gangsta mentality?
Because the streets have not changed. If the streets changed and there weren’t this lifestyle out there, then yes, it would be corny and outdated, but the streets got worse. The lifestyle of being out on the streets and not having a job and having to hustle for your money is always gonna be there. Now, add that to the testosterone level of what hard-core rap is, and it’s a weird rush. It’s really a drug to men. They get off on it. If you take a guy in the studio and he says, “I love peace and happiness,” all the guys in the room get bored. If another cat goes, “Yo, I’ll blow your mic hand off,” everybody goes, “Whoa.”
Is hip-hop a game for the young?
It’s always gonna be a game for the young because the young have the ability to key off the old. So you have Dr. J, then you have Allen Iverson. Allen Iverson was able to look at Dr. J and take it to the next level. There’s some kid now looking at Iverson and keying off of him.
Doesn’t that make it harder for the veterans?
It’s different. You have to know as you get older to take that Dr: J position. Don’t go up in the front and deal with the youngsters. Sit back and come from that godfather position over the top. I’m not in it at this point to be on the cover of every magazine. I’ve done that. You gotta let Eminem get it. It’s only right to let the new come in. The question is, at the end of the day, are you respected and can you still sell records? It’s not about being better than the newest guy, because no matter what, your true fans are gonna think you’re better.
How can you do a metal album with Body Count and still get respect from the hip-hoppers?
You just gotta keep it real. Everyone has more than one side to them. People who used to come and visit me thought I had a house full of meat hooks with people hanging off them, and I’m like, “C’mon, man.” That’s a side of me, but that ain’t all of me. I like to let loose the other sides of me too, the fun side, the crazy side, the sexual side. See, a lot of the rappers are fake. They’ll only play gangsters in films because they spent so much time building this image of being hard. Why would they do a role that’s against their image? Whereas me, I don’t give a fuck.
There have been moments when you’ve been in society’s crosshairs because of your controversial lyrics. Did you ever fear for your life?
I was scared for a while when “Cop Killer” was really in the zone. It was just a different thing for me. I had been on the weets and had people threaten me and had people after me, and I lived through that. There are ways to deal with that. In the street, if somebody makes a threatening statement against you, we’re gonna go see them. We’ll get ready and get it on and squash it right there. Most of the time, you get to them and they’re like, “Oh, no, we didn’t say that.” But that’s how you deal with it in the streets. Now, when I was dealing with the “Cop Killer” shit, I was afraid of running into a cop lover, somebody who says, “My brother’s a cop, dickhead,” and wants to cause some problem for me where I might have had to defend myself and end up in some shit. Also, the government caused a lot of the problems by vilifying me and letting the people take off on me. When the president is yelling your name on TV, it’s crazy. But in the end it all blew over.
Are you politically active today?
How do you stay political, watch CNN? And what the hell information are they getting? It’s just crazy to me. If I had $100 billion like Bill Gates, I would be in there exerting my influence. But right now the normal human being is sitting back trying to figure out whether Bush is lying or telling the truth, and it can drive you so crazy, you can forget what is going on right in front of you with your life and your family. So I think I do what most Americans do: try to take it in bits and pieces and not let it consume me. Anybody walking around the streets thinking they know what’s going on is kidding themselves. If they’re not the head of the CIA, they don’t know shit. We’re stirring up shit. We’re blowing up shit and leaving people dead. And the survivors have memories, and they’re not just going to go away. The world is connected. There’s the Internet, there’s planes. It’s not like you can just fly a few thousand miles and do something and think the shit’s not gonna come back. It may come back on our kids. So it’s a scary moment in history.
This is getting too serious. Let’s talk about pornography.
I’ve always been intrigued with that game. I was a pimp for a while, and it’s kind of the same thing. You’re not selling the woman, you’re selling the image of the woman. It’s the ultimate hustle. It’s interesting, but I’m just the kind of cat who could never totally get aroused by people I didn’t know. I can look at a picture of my girl and get off. I could not look at detached people and get off. So I like to make my own films.
“Pimps are …exciting to watch, and people want to hear us talk. But it is a dirty game and it’s a stone-hard operation.”
Can’t that get you in trouble? Look at Tommy Lee and Paris Hilton.
It’s only a problem if you don’t look good. Me and my girlfriend Coco look good, so if they ever got out, I know it wouldn’t do anything but help me. But if you’re doing anything on a videotape you don’t want out, erase the damn thing.
Speaking of pimps, the pimp is now celebrated in hip-hop.
Well, when people say pimpin’, they’re talking about the lifestyle. We used to say, “Keep it pimpish, man.” And that meant don’t take nothing too seriously. Someone wrecked your car, you’d be like, “Ahh, I’ll just get another one.” Like Iceberg Slim said, “When I lose a bitch, I don’t cry. I celebrate and just give another one a chance to be a star.”
Is being a pimp glamorous?
People like to think so because pimps are very flamboyant. They’re exciting to watch and people want to hear us talk and hear the psychology behind it all. But it is a dirty game and it’s a stonehard operation. You can’t have no one you care about, you don’t have children. You just stand on those broads for the money. And the girls won’t allow you to have a girlfriend ‘cause you’ve equated what they’re doing with money, so if you’ve got someone special, they won’t take you serious.
Is that why you got out?
Naw, I stopped the pimp game because I couldn’t get enough paper. It just wasn’t what I thought it was gonna be. Lots of pimps love the life. They love the clothes, the hanging out. I wanted money. I’ve always wanted a big house and nice things, and it didn’t seem very obtainable. So I got into hard-core crime for a while and did better.
You’ve been with Coco for two and a half years, and before that you were with the same woman for 17 years. Are you the monogamous type?
Yeah, I’ve always thought of myself as more of a Bonnie-and-Clyde cat than the kind of guy that wants to be with a whole bunch of chicks. Since we met, me and Coco haven’t been out of each other’s sight. She works with me answering the phones and setting up appointments all day, and I love it. I don’t even think about being with another chick. I mean, pussy is pussy. I think guys who are into being with lots of women do it because they like conquests or the excitement of the challenge. But once you master the game, you know there’s no challenge and no excitement. And when you find the right person, it’s the best high out there.
Lots of rock bands exploit their popularity to get women to do crazy things. Does that happen in the rap game, too?
It’s really a rock thing. But it’s not unusual for a girl who wants to meet someone like Marilyn Manson to be told, “Okay, but you gotta suck the bus driver’s dick and the light man’s dick,” and they’ll do it. It’s amazing. But after you see that, it fucks your head up because people will do low shit and there’s no limit. For the average dude, sex is so hard to get in the normal world, then you go into a power game like a rock concert and you see the same chicks that would make a normal guy take them on 25 dates before they gave it up, and they’ll lick your bus driver’s ass in a second. It really gets to your brain.
What’s the craziest thing Ice-T has seen? I’d see guys that would loan their girls to the group for autographs. But the weirdest thing I ever saw was on the Lollapalooza tour, where there was some chick in a trailer giving blowjobs. I was on the bus, and everybody was like, “You gotta see this,” so my curiosity took over. I went to the place and there were like 50 cats in a line, and this had been going on for hours. This chick must have done 500 head jobs. And when I went in there, it was dark, and someone introduced me as Ice-T, and the girl said, “Oh, you’re back.” So apparently guys had been telling her that they were Ice-T.
Between girlfriends, did you partake in the pleasures of the road?
I’ve always been a private person on the road. I’ve always thought of myself like Prince. I’d say, “Would Prince let all these people in his room? No.” So I was too conceited for my own good, and I was very hard to meet. But when you’re a star and you have access to meeting people, it’s not always that appealing. And some of these girls are scary. One night we were doing a show and Jane’s Addiction were performing, and there was a girl on the side singing every single song. So I was trying to be nice and I said, “Would you like to meet Perry [Farrell]?” Now, Perry had just gotten married. So I take this girl into the back dressing room where he is with his wife, and this girl just attacks his penis. Perry’s wife looks at me, he looks at me, and I’m like, “I didn’t know she was gonna do that.” I thought I was gonna get kicked off the tour.
How have you changed in the 20 years you have been in the business?
When you’re young, you handle everything with your dick; when you’re older, you handle it with your brain. The young Ice-T was like [screaming], “I’ll kill everybody.” The new Ice-T is more like [whispering], “You know I’ll kill you, right?” Over time, you just learn how to focus more and handle situations with more patience and less words. That’s why younger women are into older men, because older men talk with more understanding. A young guy dealing with a young chick is going through what she’s done with. You’re still trying spring break, and she’s done with spring break. So you gotta get older and wiser.
You’re still doing records and acting. Where do you see things heading?
Right now I think it’s time for me to cash in my chips. I got money in the bank, but I don’t got as much money as, say, Russell Simmons. So I want to just cash in on whatever the Ice-T name is and take some of the wisdom I’ve acquired and put it back into the game with new artists. I really want to start a production company and produce films and DVDs and art in a very independent way. I’ll never be pop. I’ll never be American Idol. But I got a lot of information, and I want to put it to good use and make lots more money.
As one would expect after reading about this perpetual motion star, the Ice-T website basically works as a roundabout with offshoots onto his various ventures. We can get you started, though. … If the irony of his diversity has not slapped you upside the face yet, this radical rapper has somehow become the “longest-running male actor in the history of television.” Take that, Richie Cunningham. … In all honesty, if you ever get the chance to speak with him in person, you will discover an individual as grounded, humble, and flat-out interesting as you have seen a bit of here. Someday the Ice-T biography movie will be a big hit.
